Haz Casino - 플레이어의 보너스 상금이 취소되었습니다.

This is related to HAZ casino.

Context:

1. Deposited funds
2. Received a bonus
3. played through and won
4. Withdrew 900CAD
5. The casino took the 900 claiming breach of bonus rules.
6. They refuse to escalate and continue to provide a canned response.

I was accused of irregular play because the bonus required 3 clean deposits during the week.

Of note:

1. The promo did not mention this stipulation
2. I had deposited ~ 850 CAD prior using the same bonus and it was never brought to my attention.
3. The bonus was given to me
4. I play at numerous sites including a few of their sister sites (SpaceLilly / GoldenStar etc) and have never been accused of irregular play.

I believe they are acting in bad faith for the following reasons:

1. False advertising - the promo should have stipulated any pre-requisites required and did not.
2. The casino has in the past (including this time) granted the bonus. If a condition was not met to receive the bonus - then it never should have been granted in the first place. If for instance the bonus required a minimum deposit of $50 and I only deposited $30 - would they give me the bonus? No. So why was this given to me a few times only to be used as an obscure clause should I request a withdrawal.
3. I do not like that the casino a) accused me of irregular play and also used their concealed (not obvious) terms and conditions to remove winnings.
4. If I was in some way trying to be fraudulent - would I continue to make deposits and play ? This is not the behavior of someone looking to take advantage of a casino.

What I believe is reasonable restitution:

1. Put the $$ back into my account.
2. Provide clearer marketing - so if there are pre-conditions - they are spelled out.
3. Do not give a bonus if there are conditions that should be met prior.
4. Compensation for having to open a dispute, the aggravation of going back and forth and not receiving an appropriate response, and the bad taste you left in my mouth by accusing me of irregular play.

Dear pearlnecklace,

Thank you very much for submitting your complaint. I’m sorry to hear about your problem. Please allow me to ask you a few questions, so I can understand the whole situation completely. Did you receive any explanation which exact rule has been breached and why your winnings have been cancelled? If there’s any relevant communication, please forward it to petronela.k@casino.guru. Have you redeemed any bonuses in your account in the past?

I hope we will be able to help you to resolve your problem as soon as possible. Looking forward to hearing from you.

Best regards,

Petronela

Hi Petronela,

I have sent the correspondence that I had with the finance department to your email. To answer your question, yes i have received bonuses in the past for all of the deposits made to Haz and provided a screenshot in my original post.

Thx.

Thank you very much, pearlnecklace, for forwarding all the relevant communication. I have checked general bonus terms and conditions carefully, and this is what I found https://www.hazcasino.com/en/info/bonus-terms:

"To ensure proper use of bonuses and fair play, HazCasino.com considers claiming Weekend Party bonuses without any other clean deposit (i.e. deposit which is not matched with any bonus) during the week as irregular gameplay to take advantage of bonuses. Players must deposit at least 150€ during the week in order to be eligible for winnings generated with Weekend Party Bonuses if they later decide to play slot games with mentioned deposit and 300€ in case of table games play. In case of irregular play mentioned above, winnings generated with Weekend Party Bonuses will be forfeited and deposit returned."

Could you please forward your bonus history too? Thank you very much in advance.

Hi Petronela,

Sent. You will notice that this was not the first time the bonus was granted - the same bonus was given to me 6X prior. They had no issue taking my deposit and giving me the bonus. I would have expected a warning message or no bonus to be given if any preconditions were not met.

Thank you very much, pearlnecklace, for providing all the necessary information. I will now transfer your complaint to my colleague Peter who will be at your assistance. I wish you best of luck and hope to see your problem being resolved to your satisfaction in the near future.

Hi pearlnecklace,

I looked at your case and understand the situation. I will contact the casino and see if I can help. I would like to invite Haz Casino to the conversation to participate in the resolution of this complaint.

We would like to ask Haz Casino to reply to this complaint. We are extending the timer by 7 days. If the casino fails to respond in the set time frame, the complaint will become ‘unresolved’ which may negatively affect its rating.

Hi pearlnecklace,

thank you for your comments.

Please know that you cannot register in the casino without agreeing (reading) to our Terms and Conditions, and it clearly states in the T&C that "10.4.6 To ensure proper use of bonuses and fair play, HazCasino.com considers claiming Weekend Party bonuses without any other clean deposit (i.e. deposit which is not matched with any bonus) during the week as irregular gameplay to take advantage of bonuses. Players must deposit at least 150€ during the week in order to be eligible for winnings generated with Weekend Party Bonuses if they later decide to play slot games with mentioned deposit and 300€ in case of table games play. In case of irregular play mentioned above, winnings generated with Weekend Party Bonuses will be forfeited and deposit returned."

So, a player would have to deposit at least 150€ during the week in order to be eligible for the winnings that derive from Weekend Party Bonuses. After thoroughly checking your deposits it was noticed that during that week you haven’t made any deposits (matched or clean), hence the decision to forfeit the winnings.

Just to note, the bonus hasn’t been given to you. The bonus is available to all the players on the cashier and players have to claim it themselves before making a deposit!

Furthermore, casinos that are operated by Mirage Corporation N.V. are not sister casinos. They are white labels and are only connected to the platform they are run.

Haz Casino isn’t a sister casino to Space Lilly or Goldenstar that you have mentioned.

Anyway, if Casino Guru needs proof regarding deposits then please let me know and we’ll gladly provide everything you need.

Best regards,

Anton

Hi Anton, appreciate the response.

Furthermore, casinos that are operated by Mirage Corporation N.V. are not sister casinos. They are white labels and are only connected to the platform they are run.

Ok - my mistake - I assumed that ultimately the Casino(s) would roll up to a parent company Mirage N.V. Its a moot point anyhow. The point I was trying to make was how can 2 different casinos operated by the same corporation treat their customers so differently. But if you are independent - then ok.

Just to note, the bonus hasn’t been given to you. The bonus is available to all the players on the cashier and players have to claim it themselves before making a deposit!

Ok - that's just semantics. Fact: I made a deposit with a match offer. Fact: The bonus amount was placed in my account - hence - the bonus was 'given' to me. Or 'applied' or 'granted'. You get the idea. It never should have been applied / given / granted in the first place.

Hi all,

Thank you for your replies.

Dear Anton,

Could you please send the proof to my email address (peter.m@casino.guru)?

Hi all,

Thank you Anton for the email. I discussed this issue with the management and our standpoint is as follows: We find the bonus feature in the casino user-unfriendly. Players don't suspect that they are not eligible for the bonus that is available right in their account. It would cause way less trouble if the bonus just popped up after the player reached the amount (€150) of deposits to be eligible to claim it. This way it just makes an impression of some sort of a "clickbait" to get the players to activate the bonus and make a deposit. If they lose, it's OK but if they win, the money will be confiscated because they were not eligible. We are convinced that the player should either get paid his winnings from the last bonus or get at least his last deposits back when he activated (but didn't really activate) this bonus. If the player isn't allowed to win with the bonus, he shouldn't be allowed to lose as well.

Hi Peter,

thank you for the answer.

Please know that players cannot create an account without agreeing to our Terms and Conditions.

It is solely players’ responsibility to read the T&C before registering and playing in a casino. 

Every rule that is written in the T&C has to be followed not only by our players but by the casino as well.. Every decision that is taken by the casino is based on the T&C. 

It is impossible for us to implement some kind of pop-up to let players know that they are eligible for the bonuses.

If we go by this logic, then every bonus in our casino is "clickbait" because there’s no way we can know if players will be breaching 'max bet rule' or 'only one bonus per player' rule. That’s why we have everything written and I’m mentioning this again, that players cannot register and play in the casino without agreeing to read our T&C.

Unfortunately, it is the casino’s decision not to refund the winnings for the following reasons:

1. The decision of finance team to forfeit the winning is exclusively based on our Terms and Conditions.

2. Hoping it will never happen again, this sets a bad precedent that players can take advantage of, for every rule that’s written in the T&C.

I look forward to your feedback.

Best regards,

Anton

Hi Anton,

thanks for responding. Appreciate it.

It's certainly not 'impossible' to enact a pop up telling customers they are eligible for bonuses. It happens everywhere - all the time.

If we go by this logic, then every bonus in our casino is "clickbait" because there’s no way we can know if players will be breaching 'max bet rule' or 'only one bonus per player' rule. 

You can't be serious. There is no way you can know if players will be breaching a max bet rule or only 1 bonus per player?

As discussed above, I really do believe HAZ is acting in bad faith, and continue to do so.

I'll let CasinoGuru weigh in.

Hi all,

Thanks for your replies. As mentioned above, we are still convinced that the player should either get paid his winnings from the last bonus or get his deposits back. 

Regarding this statement:

"If we go by this logic, then every bonus in our casino is "clickbait" because there’s no way we can know if players will be breaching 'max bet rule' or 'only one bonus per player' rule."

It's not really about breaking a rule while you have an active bonus, it's about getting the bonus in the first place. You shouldn't be allowed to activate something that you are not eligible for. It doesn't have to be a popup, there are many easy ways how to do that. The bonus can be "gray" until the player reaches the desired amount of deposits or they can be warned after they click on the bonus or the bonus doesn't have to be there at all and should be activated by support. There are many choices. The main problem is that casinos leave too much room for mistakes, doubt, or even abuse (from players) in their interfaces and very often use it against players. I'm afraid we will still have to decide in favour of the player.

Hi again,

we completely respect your opinion; however the casino’s decision still stands for the reasons I mentioned in the previous reply:

1. The decision of finance team to forfeit the winning is exclusively based on our Terms and Conditions.

2. Hoping it will never happen again, this sets a bad precedent that players can take advantage of, for every rule that’s written in the T&C.

"The main problem is that casinos leave too much room for mistakes, doubt, or even abuse (from players) in their interfaces and very often use it against players. I'm afraid we will still have to decide in favour of the player."

- Regarding this; we’re only acting upon our T&C, we’re doing nothing that is not mentioned in our T&C.

We think that it is solely player’s responsibility to read our Terms and Conditions and to abide by them. The rule was there before the player registered and played in the casino. 

By clicking Agree on the Terms and Conditions he agreed that he read them and that he would abide by those rules set by the casino. 

Lastly, I mentioned before that it is impossible for the casino to implement something that informs the player that he’s eligible for the bonuses; therefore we’ll be basing all of our decisions on our Terms and Conditions.

Best regards,

Anton

Dear Anton,

I completely understand your point of view. However, we at Casino Guru try to help players and look at things from a player's perspective. You acted upon your T&Cs but unfortunately, we don't consider the system to be very transparent and user-friendly. As I mentioned above, the complaint will be closed in favour of the player. If you change your mind, the complaint can be reopened anytime.

Best regards

Peter