Lucky Tiger Casino - 플레이어의 보너스 상금이 무효화되었습니다.

I used a bonus code that gave me 100 free spins if I deposit $25 or more. I placed bets but stayed within the wager requirements until I could see that play through requirements were met. Once they were I increased my bets. I ended up winning a lot until I was ready to stop and withdraw. I withdrew $500 on the 2nd of Nov and another $500 on the 4th. I contacted the casino a few times to complain about their withdrawal process apparently you can only withdraw $500 per day up to $2000 per week which isn’t true. Until the pending withdrawal is processed you cannot withdraw more than once with the same method. In other words you can only withdraw $500 in approximately 7-9 days. I thought that was my biggest problem, turns out it wasn’t. I logged in today to check if the pending withdrawal has finally been processed only to discover that instead of $140000 in my casino acc I only had $25. I had received an email from the casino saying I didn’t meet wagering requirements. I know this is not true because I was diligent in checking the whole time I was playing and only increased bets once I was sure I had $0 wagering requirements on my account! They have taken everything I won and left me with $25. I have spent A LOT of my money playing at this casino so I’m obviously really upset by this. I also play at other RTG casinos and never had issues at any of them. I believe this casino is a scam and never intended to pay me out and now they’re just looking for excuses. Please help me.

Dear nkapp01,

Thank you very much for submitting your complaint. I’m sorry to hear about the issue and understand your frustration. From the forwarded communication I understand that you've been accused of breaching the maximum bet rule.

I carefully checked the Bonus Terms on the website, and this is what I found (here):

„22.9. During an active bonus, the maximum bet per hand, spin, card, etc., is $10. This maximum bet rule will remain active until the wagering requirements have been completed. Betting above this limit will void the bonus and any winnings thereof."

We would like to see casinos implementing systems that would prevent players from placing higher than allowed bets, but, unfortunately, this is not standard practice yet. You were not stopped or blocked when you decided to increase your bet, and, as a result, you breached the maximum bet rule.

If you are aware of placing higher bets than the allowed ones, sadly, there is not much we can do to support your case at this time. I would strongly recommend reading all the T&Cs carefully before you start playing to avoid any misunderstandings in the future. Casinos try to design their bonuses to be as attractive as possible, but the rules must always be followed.

Please do not hesitate to forward your game history to petronela.k@casino.guru if you feel that you’ve been accused mistakenly, otherwise, I will be forced to reject your complaint. Thank you in advance for your reply and understanding.

Best regards,

Petronela

Hi there. The thing is that I knew about the terms and max bet rules for bonuses. I always thought that once I have reached wagering requirement that I could increase my bet, am I wrong in thinking that? I know for certain requirements were all met because when I was initially ready to bet more I first checked if I had played through the bonus. I had a bit more to go and kept playing further within the allowed bet amount. I increased the bet once I checked the wager requirements were met. I would like them to show me evidence of what they are claiming, if I understood it wrong then I accept what they’re saying but if I’m allowed to place higher bets once I have met play-through requirements then they are in the wrong because I know for a fact I checked several times.

We agree with you that once bonus wagering requirements were completed and winnings are transferred to a real money balance, the player should be able to place any bets as the bonus is not active anymore. Unfortunately, some casinos consider bonuses being active till a withdrawal request is placed. Could you please forward your game history to petronela.k@casino.guru? Thank you in advance.

i am not able to access my game history, the only history I can get is my deposit history. I’ve asked the casino to send me a copy and will email it as soon as I’ve received it. It’s become a matter of principle for me, Ve deposited huge amounts at this casino so the fact that they’re now doing this is just infuriating and I don’t want them getting away with doing this to other people, it’s not right. Thanks for trying to assist, I’m not confident that I’ll get a good outcome but I’m not going to let them get away with this lightly.

Kind Regards

Nicky

Dear nkapp01,

Have you succeeded in obtaining your game history from the casino, please?

Nope, I have emailed them twice now, they are not responding and I can’t see a way to get it myself 🙁

Thank you very much, nkapp01, for providing all the necessary information. I will now transfer your complaint to my colleague Matej (matej@casino.guru) who will be at your assistance. I wish you best of luck and hope to see your problem being resolved to your satisfaction in the near future.  

Hello nkapp01,

I am sorry to hear about your troubles.

I would like to invite the casino representative into the case:

Dear casino representative, could you please check the case and explain to us what happened?

Dear Nicolette,

We have checked the matter with the Finance representatives of Lucky Tiger. Please take into consideration that the winnings were voided due to exceeding the bet limit. The bet in the amount of 12.5 was placed 11/2/2022 10:24:49 AM before the wagering requirement of the coupon ROBBERY (which was Free-Spins-Winsx20: 541.20x20=10824) was completed.

As it is mentioned in the T&C, "All withdrawals at Lucky Tiger Casino are limited to $500 or AUD 500 per day, or $2,000 or AUD 2000 per week." It is also possible to submit more than one payment to the same cash out option within every 24 hours. Please reach the Finance Team via email to receive an assistance regarding this query.

Kind regards,

Lucky Tiger team

Dear Lucky Tiger Casino representative, is it possible to check the player's game logs?

(matej@casino.guru)

Dear Matej,

Sure, the gaming reports have just been sent to your email.

Please let us know if there's something else that could help.

Kind regards,

Lucky Tiger Casino team

Dear Lucky Tiger Casino representative,

I checked the log and found only one higher bet (12.5) in the group of 2.5 bets. Most likely, this bet was made by mistake. Nkapp01 didn't win anything from this bet, and the wagering contribution of this bet is insignificant.

As is written in our fair gambling codex: (https://casino.guru/fair-gambling-codex-for-casinos#max-bets)

If software enforcement is not possible, each case should be judged separately, so that only players who have broken the rule knowingly and systematically to gain an advantage are punished.

In this case, Nkapp01 didn't gain any unfair advantage and considering that only one higher bet was made during wagering (and she lost this bet), we do not believe that her winnings should be confiscated. 

I believe she could continue wagering if she realized her mistake and contacted support immediately. She probably didn't notice that instead of 2.5, she made a bet of 12.5.

Dear Matej,

As we have checked, the player has not contacted support regarding any bet mistake, I'm afraid, as well as it was not mentioned here. It is also worth mentioning that the bet might be increased to $0.1 - $0.5 per one click, so you need to press "+" sign multiple times to get to $12.5 from $2.5.

We also did not stop the player from wagering as you might have thought. When the player completed Wagering and requested the withdrawal, our Finance team received a breach of rules notification which, unfortunately, makes the payout impossible according to the terms and conditions.

Kind regards,

Lucky Tiger team

Dear Lucky Tiger Casino representative,

I will give you an example:

If you decide to drive to a new country for a vacation and you get lost in the night in the new city and use the road that looks normal but somewhere behind the tree is a one-way sign. After you pass the short route, the police stop you and ask you to pay a ridiculously high fine for what you did, which will cost you almost all the money that you have. Now honestly, answer me, would you return to that country, even when you made a mistake? I bet that you turn right away and sad return and tell everybody about your negative experience.

And it wouldn't be nice if the policemen, after stopping you, explained to you that this is a one-way street, but they understand that you have overlooked the traffic sign because you are not a local and first time there. And then they ask nicely where you are going and if you need help with navigation.

Because what I see in this case is a regular player. (definitely not a bonus hunter (from a playstyle)). This player made over 6000 bets; in one bet, she accidentally bet $2.5 more than she should have. She didn't even win this bet. (if she would win from this bet a considerable amount, of course, you should void the winnings) but not when it is obvious that this single bet was an accident. She didn't get any benefit from it. So arguing that the max bet rule was breached is an excuse not to pay her—nothing else.

We have many casinos on our website that would pay this player without hesitation, and if you do not believe me, I can post many examples of such behaviour here.

It is your decision on which side you want to be on. To be the strict casino trying to find anything to avoid paying or a fair casino that accepts that players may win and are happy when players are happy. Because more happy players are the goal for the casino and not to save every cent possible.

So please, consult this case with your management and let me know which type of casino you want to be.

We are following our fair gambling codex when we make decisions in complaints.

Dear Matej,

Despite being compliant with our terms and conditions, we do consider each case separately, and our goal has always been making our players happy.

As we have checked with the Finance department, it had been decided to make an exception for the customer and pay her $1000. The amount will be sent in one transaction to the bank account today.

Kind regards,

Lucky Tiger Casino team

Dear Lucky Tiger Casino representative,

I appreciate your effort but do you think that $2,5 over the maximum bet should cost nkapp01 $14000?

As I wrote before, when we consider complaints, we are bidden by our fair gambling codex, where this situation is clear. nkapp01 should have entire winnings; her mistake is insignificant to wagering.

I can paste here 10 cases where the casino, without a problem, admitted that such a mistake was insignificant and paid the player if you don't believe me.

We would like to ask the Casino to reply to this complaint. We are extending the timer by 7 days. If the casino fails to respond in the set time frame, we will close the complaint as ‘unresolved’ which may negatively affect its rating.

Hi, i received an email feom the casino where they said they have decided to pay me $1000 of the winnings. They did pay the $1000 into my account but I personally think it just shows that they know they are in the wrong and trying to get me to close this case. Dont know how they thought $1000 would make me happy cobsidering how much I actually won. I really appreciate your help so far, lets see what they do next.....Kind Regards Nicolette.

Hi Matej, i also wanted to mention that the soecific game i was playing "Copy cat" is the only game I play that is very easy to accidentally increase a bet without knowing because the spin and + buttons are right next to each other, i can send you a screenshot if you want so you can see what I mean, also, if betting 2,50 you only need to click + twice to get to 12,50 so its not as many as theyd like you to believe and very easy to do by mistake , I have accidentally done it before where i was unknowingly betting $25 at a time and quickly changed back. Just thought Id point that out so you are aware.

Kind Regards

Nicolette Kapp

Hello,

Please kindly note that the Casino terms applied before the user started playing. The Lucky Tiger T&C apply to all registered customers, that do accept the terms upon registration. The rules are the very same for all the customers. If they are not obeyed, what the sense in having them at all is. Every player who use our services knows about them and accepts all regulations. Let us kindly remind that para. 22. Bonus Terms clearly states the following: "During an active bonus, the maximum bet per hand, spin, card, etc., is $10. This maximum bet rule will remain active until the wagering requirements have been completed. Betting above this limit will void the bonus and any winnings thereof." Despite the fact that the client has violated this point by placing $12.5 bet, we consider we made a decent exception, having payed the amount that has been initially requested ($1000). It was the act of empathy from our side despite the breach of the software terms, agreed upon the contract. Being a legal entity carrying the official license of Curacao, we are aimed to abide all the policies listed on website and passed to them upon contract signature.

We would like to point out that the forums have always been respecting and supporting the Casino policies, and in case of customers' violations, every time took the Casino side. Please advise us why this attitude has changed.

Kind regards,

Lucky Tiger Casino team

Hi Matej, As I mentioned in the msg above, one of my favorite games Copy Cat only needs 2 clicks to change a bet from $2.5 to $12.5, I cannot remember whether I was playing Copy Cat or Cash Bandits 3 when the bet was accidentally increased but I wanted to let you know that Cash Bandits 3 also only requires 2 clicks to go from a $2.50 bet to $12.50.

It seems to me that the casino is purposely trying to be misleading by telling you in their words-

" the bet might be increased to $0.1 - $0.5 per one click, so you need to press "+" sign multiple times to get to $12.5 from $2.5"

It really only takes 2 clicks and it's very easy to do when you're playing on a mobile phone as I do.

I'm really hoping this can be resolved amicably, what they're doing really isn't right or fair.

Kind Regards

Dear Lucky Tiger Casino team,

You wrote: forums have always been respecting and supporting the Casino policies, and in case of customers' violations, every time took the Casino side. Please advise us why this attitude has changed.

Now please check this case from 2016 (not our case):

https://thepogg.com/complaint/slotjoint-wont-pay-5000-winning/

Here player made several higher bets, but because he didn't win from these bets, the casino paid that player eventually after thepogg convinced them. (so you can see what the forum thinks, and this was in 2016!!!)

This article was published by thepogg in 2020:

https://thepogg.com/the-maximum-bet-problem/

It is about problems with the max bet rule and that the casinos should enforce it by software.

And here is a shining example of how you should react:

https://casino.guru/craze-play-casino-player-s-winnings-were-confiscated

Now for a second, imagine that you are in our shoes. We have over 4000 casinos on our website.

Some of these casinos already enforce max bet by software (rocketplay, pledoo, riobet...). Many are willing to pay the player if they don't get an unfair advantage. (If nkapp01won from this higher bet, of course, we would be on your side)

We are creating ratings of these casinos (or sorting the casinos from best to worst). Because in such situations, players can quickly lose the winnings, and in other casinos, no, logically, you should be sorted behind the casinos where this situation cannot happen, am I right?

Dear Matej,

Thanks for the details!

According to the example you sent, your colleague does agree that 'the max bet rule is an industry standard' and that you 'prefer not to go against industry standards by penalizing casinos.'

It was also mentioned that each case is being judged individually though, and the casino made an exception for the player just as we did by sending the amount requested. The rest was automatically deducted from the balance upon the breach of terms.

We prefer to be open and fair, so let's go through the complaint once again please and point out the initial issue:

'The thing is that I knew about the terms and max bet rules for bonuses... I increased the bet once I checked the wager requirements were met. I would like them to show me evidence of what they are claiming, if I understood it wrong then I accept what they’re saying but if I’m allowed to place higher bets once I have met play-through requirements then they are in the wrong because I know for a fact I checked several times.'

We have provided the evidence that the bet was placed prior to wagering being completed, and the player did confirm that she would accept it. Despite that, we did make a decent exception, and we believe that considering more of those would be unfair towards other active players as well as future customers. We hope that you understand that the misconception of the terms being flexible would end up with chaotic policy.

Being a licensed and fair casino tested over the years, we also believe that it would be fair for the third parties to respect the Terms and Conditions of other companies since those are openly stated at the website as well as being accepted by each client upon registration. The exceptions can be made by the casino to a certain extent, but should not question the fairness toward all clients.

Kind regards,

Lucky Tiger Casino team

Dear Lucky Tiger Casino team.

I can offer you our logic how we evaluate similar cases so there will be no chaos:

When a player breaches the the max bet once or multiple times, but the result is a a loss -> Player didn't get any advantage and should be paid.

When a player breaches the max bet once or multiple times and wins from such a bet (breached max bet) -> the Player gained an advantage, and the winnings should be void (in an ideal world, only winnings from a bet(s) which breached the max bet are voided.)

The problem is that on our website, we are promoting the casinos which are fair and safe for the players and because in many casinos, this situation couldn't happen or in case it happened, the casino will handle the situation differently. (I sent you some examples) I am afraid that we don't have a choice and need to penalize you for that.

One bet which was not even significantly higher than the max bet, which ended in a loss, shouldn't be a reason to confiscate $15k.

So I am very sorry, but despite your nice gesture of paying the Player $1k. We still believe that there is $14k missing.

If this is your final answer, we will evaluate the complaint as I wrote.

Dear Matej,

We have always been a fair and safe casino with every single complaint resolved, and never confiscated players' winnings if the terms have not been violated.

I see that we have different points of view, and although we don't believe it would be fair to penalize the casino for being strict to their terms, especially taking into account your position not to go against the industry standards, yes, this is our final answer.

From our side, we will continue doing our best to make all of our customers satisfied and aware of the terms while playing with a bonus.

Kind regards,

Lucky Tiger Casino team

Dear Matej and Nicolette,

Having checked and discussed all the details of the case once again, the Casino has decided to make a great exception for the player and make the whole amount eligible to be withdrawn. We have always been acting according to our terms, but we also chose to listen to your point of view and make a larger exception. We respect your fair gambling codex and prefer to keep the reputation of an open and fair casino.

Nicolette, please feel free to submit your withdrawal requests and stay in touch with our finance department.

Kind regards,

Lucky Tiger Casino team

Dear Lucky Tiger Casino team,

Thank you for your cooperation and the exception you made.

Dear Nicolette,

Please confirm that the balance is available and that we can close the complaint.

Hi Matej,

The balance is available as promised and I have submitted a request to withdraw funds, I will let you know if there are any problems with the withdrawal process but I’m optimistic that this won’t be the case. Thank you for all your help.

Thank you for the info. We will wait for your confirmation.

Dear nkapp01,

We are extending the timer by 7 days. Please, be aware that in case you fail to respond in the given time frame or don’t require any further assistance, we will reject the complaint.

I’m not sure how long it’s going to take to withdraw all the funds, i submitted my first withdrawal on 06/01 and received an email on 16/01 to let me know $1000 withdrawal was approved, I received another email on 17/01 and another $1000 was approved, still takes up to 7 days after that before funds are in my account apparently. I can only withdraw $500 per payment method so $1000 for me because I can only use wire transfer and credit card method. I am able to submit another $500x2 the following day but the casino has a maximum rule of 4 withdrawals until the current withdrawals are processed and no longer showing in the withdrawal section which seems to take around 10 days. I’ll keep you posted. Thanks for all your help so far.

Kind Regards

Nicky

Thanks for the info (fingers crossed). We will keep the complaint open until the last payment is made.

Dear nkapp01,

We are extending the timer by 7 days. Please, be aware that in case you fail to respond in the given time frame or don’t require any further assistance, we will reject the complaint.

Still going, at this rate I'd say it will be a few more months before all the funds are paid.

So far received $4000.

Then let me close the complaint as resolved, and in case anything goes wrong, you can just reopen the case.

Dear nkapp01,

We are extending the timer by 7 days.

Because of all written above, I am closing this complaint as resolved.

The player can reopen this complaint at any time.