Dublinbet Casino - 플레이어의 보너스 상금이 무효화되었습니다.

I recently received 50 free spins with dublinbet. I think I won about 10 euro. I went on and asked about the wagering requirements because I noticed that my old bonuses were still active even though they say that the will automatically close when you balance falls below 1 euro but they had not so was still paying off those wagering requirements.Told me there was a bug in the system. I then proceeded to play with my bonus funds and got lucky winning around 3200 euro. My first big win. When I woke up in the morning my funds were gone. I got onto them and they said I broke the rules. They said because I bought a few bonuses that I broke the €5 per spin rule which it is not(in their T&C it clearly states that you cannot bet more than €5 PER SPIN). I was only playing .20c per spin but the bonus cost €20. They have now stolen my funds and tell me there is nothing I can do about it. And now this morning I noticed that they have blocked my account. Is always funny as soon as you win anything there is bother . Never have any trouble accepting money. When I bought the bonuses it said nothing about breaking any rules. I thought the days of online casinos scamming you were over but dublinbet are still going strong. I will let you know if they get back to me.

Date of experience: 19 February 2023

Dear jonathankinane,

Thank you very much for submitting your complaint and forwarding all the relevant communication. I’m sorry to hear about the issue and understand your frustration. I carefully checked the Bonus Terms on the website, and this is what I found (here):

The maximum amount you are allowed to bet per spin when playing with a bonus is €5 per bet (or equivalent in any other currency) until the wagering requirements of the bonus have been met.

We would like to see casinos implementing systems that would prevent players from placing higher than allowed bets, but, unfortunately, this is not standard practice yet.

Please do not hesitate to forward your game history to petronela.k@casino.guru if you feel that you’ve been accused mistakenly.

Lastly, do I understand correctly that your entire winnings have been accumulated from Free Spins?

I hope we will be able to help you to resolve this issue and receive your winnings as soon as possible. Looking forward to hearing from you.

Best regards,

Petronela

No I used the 10 euro that I won from free spins. And if you read the line you sent me. It does say per spin which I did not do. I bought a bonus at .20 a spin that cost 20 euro.

I actually bought multiple bonuses over the space of about 5 hours

Oh and they have locked me out of my account but before that they deleted my entire gaming history

Thank you very much, jonathankinane, for providing all the necessary information. I will now transfer your complaint to my colleague Branislav (branislav.b@casino.guru) who will be at your assistance. I wish you best of luck and hope to see your problem being resolved to your satisfaction in the near future.  

Hello, jonathankinane,

I am sorry to hear about your unpleasant experience. I will contact the casino and try my best to resolve the issue as soon as possible. Now I would like to invite Dublinbet Casino's representative to join this conversation and participate in the resolution of this complaint.

Dear Dublinbet Casino Team,

Could you please provide us with an explanation of the player's situation in more detail? Why has her account been blocked/closed and the winnings confiscated? What steps should the player take to unblock the account?

If we are talking about a breach of the casino's Terms and Conditions, is the casino able to substantiate its decision with relevant evidence?

It is possible to share the data directly here, with your reply, or by sending them to my email address (branislav.b@casino.guru).

Thank you in advance for providing the information.

Hi All!

Thank you for reaching out to us.

We have reviewed the relevant account for K***** Jonathan (ID 2436191) and we can confirm that our dedicated Payments Team have acted in accordance with our Terms and Conditions for Bonus which can be found here.

In this case the player has purchased a bonus of 100 Spins priced at 0.20 Cent per Spin. The cost of this 'spin' was 20Euro and hence, the bonus funds generated were confiscated. As per our Terms

''The maximum amount you are allowed to bet per spin when playing with a bonus is €5 per bet (or equivalent in any other currency) until the wagering requirements of the bonus have been met."

We stand by our decision of confiscating the money   given that the player has made legal and legislative threats against us, we also decided to close the account, we do hope you understand our position.

Should the complaint be resolved and player is on the same page as us, we can re open the account, as a gesture of good faith.

Thanks,

Customer Support Management

The only reason I threatened Legal action was your support told me there was nothing I could do about it. Would not transfer to a manager, would not give me any details of the company so I could contact ye. More or less told me to get lost. If you think this is an isolated incident I urge to check out your score on trust pilot

Thank you, Dublinbet Casino team, for your explanation.

Dear jonathankinane,

Can you please confirm that you played with bets higher than €5 while using the winnings from Free Spins and having an active bonus? If yes, do you agree with the casino's decision and account reopening?

Why would I want to reopen account when they don't pay out?

My god there are higher reviews for ponzi schemes on trust pilot. https://ie.trustpilot.com/review/dublinbet.com

I went through the whole thread again carefully, and indeed, there are some things that I overlooked, and I would like to clarify with the casino before we move forward.

Dear Dublinbet Casino team,

Does the used purchase (100 Spins = €20) while playing with the bonus fall under the "All "buy feature" Games"?

If the player played only with 0.20 bets, and he did not exceed this limit per bet, can you please send me a rule that prohibits the games' features while playing with the bonus and a link where I can find it?

Hi all,

Thank you for getting back to us. We understand the player's situation, hopefully the below information will help provide some clarity.

''The maximum amount you are allowed to bet per spin when playing with a bonus is €5 per bet (or equivalent in any other currency) until the wagering requirements of the bonus have been met."

If the player is using Bonus funds to purchase a Bonus in-game, and the transaction amounts to more than a 5Euro bet, it will count as a breach of terms.

I have attached a screenshot from the transaction history, there are multiple bets over 5Eu at around the date and time 18/02/2023 15:35:15.

Please let me know if anything is not clear and we will get back to you as soon as possible.

Thanks and regards,

Customer Support Management

Thanks for re-looking into it. It is very frustrating that I think I only won about 10 euro from the free spins and this casino is know n for this. On all other casinos that are reputable they will not allow you to breach terms when you open any particular games. I highly doubt if I had lost that they would have said a word.

Dear Dublinbet Casino team,

Thank you for the additional information.

However, are your claims somehow supported by any rules from the casino's Terms and Conditions?

I am afraid my previous questions have not been answered at all. Therefore, I would like to repeat them.

"Does the used purchase (100 Spins = €20) while playing with the bonus fall under the "All "buy feature" Games"?

...can you please send me a rule that prohibits the games' features while playing with the bonus and a link where I can find it?"

From our point of view, considering our policy and Fair Gambling Codex, and based on the casino's Terms and Conditions, the casino either should not allow the players to breach the T&Cs unknowingly (enforce them by the system/software) or - as it is always required from the players - to comply with them too. Thus, such bets should not be counted toward the wagering requirements if the players can access these games/features while playing with a bonus. Unfortunately, I could not find any rule in the casino's Terms and Conditions that would state anything else. If I overlooked something, please, feel free to correct me.

Hi ,

To whom it may concern.

We would like to clarify that the breach in this case is that the transaction was over 5Eu.

Had the player in this case bought a bonus for less than 5 Euro, it would not have been considered a breach, since the transaction debiting his Bonus Balance would have been less than 5 Euro.

We hope this clarifies the above.

Let us know if you require more information from our end.

Thank you,

Customer Support Management

This is irrelevant. There are no bonuses for less than 5 euro

Dear Dublinbet Casino team,

So, do I understand correctly that bets in such games ("buy feature" games) are not counted toward the bonus wagering requirements, but the players are allowed to buy/use the games' features, and these transactions are deducted and credited from/to the bonus money balance?

Is there any rule that forbids buying and using the games' features while playing with a bonus? If yes, can you provide us with information on exactly what rule it is, and where on the casino's website can I find it? Are players informed that using these features may mean that their bonuses and winnings will be forfeited or that the casino will take them into account for considering the maximum bet amount while playing with bonus funds/winnings?

The player allegedly obtained the bonus money from Free Spins. Were the transactions over €5 made while he was wagering the winnings from the mentioned Free Spins? What is the wagering requirement for the bonus used? Were the wagering requirements for the winnings from the bonus met before he bought the first game feature, or the wagering requirements were not met?

Could you please provide me with the complete player's gaming history? It would be appreciated if it could include the player's ID/email and all the transactions/bets and claimed bonuses with the exact dates and times.

Feel free to use my email (branislav.b@casino.guru).

Looking forward to hearing from you.

Hello

To whom it may concern.

There are not restrictions of games using bonus or real money , The player has the liberty to play his favourite game using the bonuses, however if player is choosing to use the bonus on an specific game there are ( conditions of wagering ) to take into account.

https://www.dublinbet.com/bonus-terms-and-conditions/

If player is using All "buy feature" Games the contribution of the stake will be 0% and if player used the feature to buy bonus with bonus money player is actually placing 100x bets on one round, ( 20 EUR to get 0,20 EUR bonus round)

Therefore iff players buy a bonus, it will nearly always exceed the 5 EUR max bet even if he is using bonus money or real money.

In this case the player has purchased a bonus of 100 Spins priced at 0.20 Cent per Spin. The cost of this 'spin' was 20Euro and hence, the bonus funds generated were confiscated. As per our Terms

''The maximum amount you are allowed to bet per spin when playing with a bonus is €5 per bet (or equivalent in any other currency) until the wagering requirements of the bonus have been met."

I have attached the transaction history, there are multiple bets over 5Eu at around the date and time 18/02/2023 15:35:15.

We stand by our decision of confiscating the money   given that the player has made legal and legislative threats against us, we also decided to close the account, we do hope you understand our position.

Should the complaint be resolved and player is on the same page as us, we can re open the account, as a gesture of good faith.

If you have any other questions or assistance required please let us know.

Dublinbet Casino team,

Thank you for the additional explanation.

In the meantime, I also discussed the matter internally with my team. However, we unanimously agreed that the player did not gain any advantage by purchasing the game feature. We see the main issue in displaying the amounts in your reports or in considering bets/transactions. As you yourself confirmed above, the player used 100 spins, €0.20 per spin. Thus, the maximum bet amount was not exceeded by any of these spins. For better imagination, the €20 transactions from your report could be divided into 100 spins, €0.20 each.

Is there any difference between normal spins in the game and spins within a game feature? Are we talking about any special spins? If yes, can you explain the difference and advantage that could be gained by using this feature? If not, is the casino please able to reconsider its decision regarding the confiscated winnings?

Can I ask a question? Why allow the purchase at all if it's not permitted. All legitimate casinos won't allow you to purchase feature if is against rules? You say I was at liberty to play the game .....as long as I didn't win anything you mean I presume?

So in other words you had no problems taking my money as long as I lost!

Hello,

When we refer to a bet we refer that If player is wagering 0.20, for instance, may spend 20 eur (100x) to trigger the feature. in this case he has wagered 20 eur of bet, as The feature buy option costs 100x the stake and he must pay 20 eur to activate this option. it means that player is placing ( 20 eur of bet) 

The amount needed to use bonus buy differs based on the game. However, player’ll typically need to risk between 50x and 100x the bet size.

Following the above, we can confirm that the bet is not based on the value of freespins but is based on the total bet amount, the player was using ( bonus money ) in this case 20 eur (bonus money ) to buy Freespins . 

Therefore we can conclude that a bet of 20 eur exceed the maximum amount allowed when playing with bonus money.

Thank you

Greetings all,

I am really sorry for the delay (bank holidays).

Dear Dublinbet Casino team,

Although our attitude was already explained, I would like to sum all the information up.

• The casino claims that the player exceeded the maximum bet amount while playing with the bonus
• Basically, we are talking about 100 x €0.20 bets that even does not mean any advantage for the player (nothing else has been proved or claimed until now)
• There is no rule saying the games' features are not allowed to play while playing with bonus money (nothing else has been proved or claimed until now), but the casino let players do it and then confiscates their winnings for doing it since it automatically means that they breach the maximum bet rule; moreover, it is not clear to a common player that €0.20 bets can exceed the maximum bet amount of €5, especially if the casino allows it, or if the player is not informed about it
• Several questions are still unanswered

As was already mentioned, after the internal discussion with my team, we are not able to accept the casino's decision. The maximum bet amount rule is usually applied while playing with the bonus money for some reason. But, in this case, it is clear that it was not the player's intention to abuse the bonus, and he did not gain any advantage by playing in this way. Especially if the transactions were not counted to the wagering requirements.

Is the casino please able and willing to reconsider its decision and return the confiscated winnings to the player?

Please note if the casino's decision remains unchanged, the complaint will be closed as unresolved, and the casino's rating will be decreased accordingly.

Hello all,

yes , we can agree that player has made bets for more than 5 eur which is not allowed in our terms and conditions.

When we speak about buying bonus with bonus money on a feature Game we can confirm that you will need to make a bet in order to buy the amount wanted. In this case the amount of the bet was 20 eur bonus to buy 100 Freesoipins, therfore player has breached terms and conditions.

We strongly advise the player to use only the slots which help with the wagering , if player uses bonus on a feature Game slots , the contribution of the wagering will be 0% as is showing in our website, it means players are allow to play with bonus money on any game however they will need to choose the ones which contribute 100% with the wagering.

Kindly note that our dedicated Payments Team have acted in accordance with our Terms and Conditions .

and the desicion is not reversible .

Thank you .

Greetings all,

Thank you for your reply, Dublinnbet Casino Team.

However, as was explained and indicated in my previous posts, since the casino is not able and willing to change its decision and reconsider the player's case, we decided to close this complaint as unresolved, and the casino's rating will be decreased accordingly.

We see a significant difference between a bet amount and a transaction (purchasing an in-game feature) amount that is shown in the casino's reports as if it were the same. It is not. The player purchased 100 Free Spins while he was playing with an active bonus, so he basically just changed his money for Free Spins of the same amount. As we assume that there is no difference between a normal spin of €0.20 and a spin of the same amount bought using the in-game feature (nothing else has been claimed or proved until now), such a bet is not even counted toward the wagering requirements, the casino's Terms and Conditions do not prohibit it, and no one of the player's bets/spins did not exceed the maximum bet amount, which means he did not gain any advantage by playing in this way and did not try to abuse the bonus, our attitude is clear. We consider the casino's decision and/or the application of its rules unfair, and against our Fair Gambling Codex. Therefore, we cannot accept it.

In addition, we recommend the casino amend its Terms and Conditions either to a more comprehensible and understandable form for players or to reconsider their application.

Dear jonathankinane,

Unfortunately, since the casino's decision is final, we have no other option but to close the complaint.

I recommend contacting the gaming authority that regulates the casino (Curacao eGaming) and submitting a complaint directly to the regulator. It is possible to file a complaint via the license validator (clicking on the license validator logo on the casino website) and use a "File a Complaint with CEG" button. Before submitting the complaint, make sure you provide all the necessary information: your personal data, the casino details, your login details in the casino, the issue description, and supporting attachments if it is needed. In case of any questions or news regarding your issue, do not hesitate to contact me at branislav.b@casino.guru.

I wish I could be of more help. I sincerely hope you will not come across a problem like this again.

But, the casino can reopen this complaint anytime once it changes its approach and decision, and you will be informed about it via email. I sincerely hope the casino will use this option in the future.

Best regards,

Branislav, Casino.Guru